Reader query on publishing before grad school

A reader writes in,

I have read The Philosophers' Cocoon and I've got some really good advice from there (for example about publishing). For my knowledge there is one topic that has not been discussed before: publishing before grad school. I was wondering if you or any other contributors have any advice about this?

I am from a small European country with few chances to do a PhD in philosophy with funding. I have applied to universities in my country but I did not get a funded position even though I have published an article in a top journal of my field of specialisation [editorial note: I can confirm that it is a top journal in the AOS] . I was wondering if I should apply to PhD programs outside my country. I’ve got a few questions about it. How useful is it to have a peer-reviewed publication when applying to grad school? Can it be bad for the applicant to already have a publication – or a few – when applying to grad school (I’ve got a few papers under review as well)? I have two Master’s degrees (one from philosophy) from two different universities in my country. Is there a chance to get a funded position from the U.S or U.K, since I do not have an undergraduate degree from a prestigious university, but a publication in a well-respected journal? If I need a writing sample when applying, can it be my published article and would that be good? Is there any general advice on whether I should apply to the most prestigious universities, “middle league” or just decent universities?

Some good questions! Any thoughts from readers?

Obviously, this person does have some grad school experience, having done a Masters in philosophy--but my general thoughts are these: it seems to me perfectly fine to publish before grad school if one publishes in a highly-ranked journal. However, I think it is probably advisable to stay away from publishing anything not in a top journal. This is for two reasons. First, given how much prestige plausibly plays a role in grad school admissions, publishing in a non-top-ranked journal might not be looked at favorably by highly-ranked programs. Second, since one has not done a PhD yet, if one publishes outside of a top-ranked venue the chances are significant that one may publish something of low philosophical quality--the kind of quality that could potentially hamper one's career prospects later, or which one might simply regret later on.

In terms of whether the person should submit their publication when applying to grad schools, my thoughts are that they probably should, since it is a very good journal (although it is a fairly narrow AOS). I'm also inclined to think that because they have a good publication and the academic job-market is so difficult, they should apply to highly-ranked programs as well as any other programs with a good placement record.

But these are just some of my thoughts. What do you all think?

Comments

[Joe]

I would say that if we are actually at a point where an *undergraduate's* non-elite publications would be looked down upon by any department whatsoever, then it's time to blow it all up and start again. Surely that requirement is as absurd as it gets!

[Marcus Arvan]

Hi Joe: I appreciate the sentiments behind your comment, but three quick thoughts.

First, I may be wrong! Maybe grad admissions committees wouldn't care. This is why I figured it might be good to open this for discussion. :)

Second, absurd things can be actual - so even if we think we should change things, there's still a question of what individual candidates should do given actual conditions.

Third, it is not obviously absurd to me to think one should not try to publish in professional venues before one is ready (undergrad or grad journals seem to me one thing, professional journals another). Further, it is not obviously absurd to me for an admissions committee to wonder about the judgment of someone who publishes, say, poor work in a professional venue before receiving professional training!

Personally, I don't think I would hold it against an applicant, but at the same time, it is not that hard for me to see how someone could. But again, I might be totally off on this!

[Mark]

This comment is only tangentially related, but seems appropriate enough here: It would probably be a nice addition to the culture of philosophy if faculty started writing essays with their undergraduate students. Certainly there are faculty tutorials or independent studies that can either result in or be geared toward writing a professional publishable paper. It is a nice way to introduce advanced students to the process of publishing and acknowledges their contribution, even if it is somewhat less than the faculty member's.

[Postdoc]

Being able to publish anything in a journal that matters as an undergrad without serious help from faculty is probably impossible but for a few geniuses.

What you don't want to do is publish in a crappy place, as I think that could look bad.

You could try to publish in an undergrad journal, but I'm not sure if they count for much of anything.

I would concentrate on other things.

[Postdoc]

Whoaaa!!! I should have read more carefully. You have a paper in a top journal for your AOS, BUT COULD NOT GET A FUNDED POSITION IN YOUR COUNTRY!!!!????

Is it just a review article or a short 1-3 page response?

If it's a real, full length article, I would think you should have no problem getting into a funded PhD program at a top university.

However, prestige bias is a huge problem in the US and UK. They often prefer candidates with fancy undergraduate degrees over candidates who have shown the ability to actually produce philosophy.

So, who knows. Being from a non prestigious university will hurt you. But if you've got a real article published in a top place for your AOS and cannot get a funded position in a top 30 program that's an indictment of the field!

If you cannot get into a top 30 program, I wouldn't do the PhD. It'll be almost impossible to secure a permanent position.

[Amanda]

I would fore sure apply to top places as well as others. I think you have a great shot. The process is crazy though, so if you can apply to 10-20 schools. The closer to 20 the better your odds. I really regret only applying to 8 schools.

[Carlo Ierna]

I think there are large differences per country. In Europe it is normal to have done a (2 year) masters before starting a (3-4 year) PhD. I don't think people care much about where you did your BA (or what your grades were). I too did publish before applying to a PhD position (through a personal grant) and my publication certainly helped me get the funding. Things might be different when applying to a grad school or a job opening, but for getting grants (including PhD grants) my experience is that any and all peer-reveiwed publications certainly help.

[Kenneth Pearce]

Conventional wisdom is that publication in a student journal or presentation at a student conference helps a little, or in any event certainly doesn't hurt, when it comes to graduate admissions (but is not as important as other factors). How could publication in a professional journal – even a lower-tier (but still legitimate) professional journal – not be like that but better?

For the record: I had a paper accepted to a good specialist journal (Religious Studies) before applying to grad school, and now I have a PhD and a job. Usual caveats: sample size 1, correlation is not causation, a billion other factors in play, including a lot of luck. But I really can't imagine that a publication in a legitimate journal would hurt you. (Of course, different admission committee members might have different opinions about which journals are 'legitimate', and it could certainly hurt you if a particular committee member thinks the journal in which you published is not a legitimate journal.)